Thank you for this walk which gives lots of things to really think about. I don't believe that Jesus was born in December as that is the winter in the Northern Hemisphere and the shepherds would not be out in the fields during winter. I guess my family celebrate it at this time of the year because that is what we have been bought up with and I am not sure God really cares when we celebrate as long as we remember the true meaning of what we celebrate but I may be wrong about that. There are so many conflicting things said when it comes to the Christmas Tree, and the Magi (according to one definition they were members of a priestly caste of ancient Persia. and because they saw the star and new it was important they may have been astrologers) Isaiah 60;6 mentions the bringing of Frankincense and Gold and proclaiming good news of the praises of the Lord. To me the giving of gifts symbolises the fact that Jesus was given as a gift to the world for the forgiveness of sin. I am one that does not go overboard with decorating or gift giving. Probably haven't answered your questions with all this though.
Dec 23, 2023·edited Dec 23, 2023Liked by Donny Mac
Hmmm. I'm asking myself how exactly to respond because, like you, I don't want to try to justify my stance, but in a way I feel that's what you're asking me to do. Scripture doesn't say "don't celebrate the birth of Jesus", so how we choose to do that has to be what's right in our own hearts. To me the exact date is not important, or whether all the details happened as tradition has dictated. I could go into what the tree means to me, why I decorate, why I give and receive gifts, why I sing certain songs, but I know in my heart that I do what I do because I love recognizing that God became flesh and dwelt among us and Jesus' birth was the beginning of God intervening in humanity in a way that would provide a way to be in relationship with Him. No time of year points to Christ more than Christmas. Some don't get the true meaning, but they have at least heard about it. The story of Easter has also been messed up with human traditions. In our house, Santa was always a fictitious character, but Jesus was real. I know you may disagree, but I think God gives us some grace for not having every detail exactly right as long as the focus is on worshipping Him and honoring the fact that he sent Jesus to earth for our salvation. I hope you can worship Him in spirit and in truth and not focus on how others choose to do it. Thanks for the questions. I sure don't have all the answers but do what the Spirit tells you is right for you. Stunning place for a prayer walk! Hope you have some joyful time with family on the 25th no matter what you think about the date! 😊
This prayer walk has been your most confrontational yet! I grew up celebrating Christmas with Santa and Jesus. Although, Santa was just a small part of the celebration. As I raised our children, we put the focus on Jesus and talked about what we could give to God for Christmas- sometimes it was adding to our tithes, buying for a needy family, doing a service project for someone, or baking goodies for people. Now that my kids are grown, I wish I had put even more emphasis on God's gift for us- salvation through Jesus. You asked if we thought God wanted us to celebrate Jesus' birthday. I would say, yes. Well, as the Bible says, the angels rejoiced, the shepherds rejoiced. Even Mary rejoiced in her heart. I think God wants us to celebrate. I am not sure that He is happy with all the secular emphasis though.
There is a lot to think about in this topic, and it is one I have struggled with for many years. Thank you for sharing this space for seeking God's truth.
I filled a page with notes over the last two days as I examine my own practices, our family traditions and what I observe in my community.
I have a lot of reading to do in light of the questions you asked.
Holy Spirit, show us how we can live in this world and honor God.
Hi Donny ~ I get the points you were making... But I had a long conversation with God after listening to your Prayer Walk today. I'm pretty sure I heard him say, "Keep doing what you're doing in memory of me." It's just a Faith thing for me. I feel good about celebrating Jesus's birth on Christmas with my family. Hope you are also surrounded by Love on Monday -- and everyday. ~ Jan xoxo
I grew up no different than most Anglican or protestant children. The thing is I was like you always looking for what was truth in Jesus. About 2012 I was wanting to attend a church that really honored God. The way I wanted to worship did not fit the church I was attending. I was told to go to a Messianic congregation. That was great advice because I did and never regretted it. I learned to much about all of the Jewish feast days. I learned how those days lined up with what really happened from the birth of Christ to the Passover and even Day of Pentecost. I do know Constantine.was not good for the Jews and he denied them their beliefs. The gentile church turned idols into saints to give them faces. They twisted the story of Abraham and Isaac to Abraham and Ishmael. Once the lies were told it was hard to see what was true. Scripture tells me this, ”And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.“
John 1:14 NKJV
When Jesus a set date was not established but based on Sukkot chances are great because of the desire to dwell with us it was possible while everyone was dwelling in tents no one would have had any indoor rooms available. Herod had heard the prophecy regarding Jesus. The wise men were spies and were out to kill Jesus at His birth.
We stopped having a normal Christmas tree years ago and Santa is not on anything here. I must admit I like the cute stories but I count them as what I find to be good to rejoice in them. I do birthdays to show my love to those I cherish. I wanted you to know I cheer your stance and love how you search the truth. There is so much to discuss on this topic. Know that you don’t offend me whatsoever. My daughter is dating a Muslim and he told me he is related to Jesus. All I could do was laugh. I know my prayer time has a new challenge. I’ll just say to you happy Holyday my friend.
I forgot to mention that my way of celebrating Christmas is first to be part of the Christmas Eve Mass at St. Francis parish where my husband works. It's beautiful, and Fr. Dick always invites the children to gather around the alter with him at a certain point, and asks them questions about who Jesus is ,and other related questions. (Some of the answers are pretty funny, while others are more serious and well thought out.) Then on Christmas Day my husband John and I usually go to a family dinner at his sister's condo. That's it, I promise! 🕊✨️
After reading the passages about Jesus's birth (Luke 1: 26-38, and Matthew 1: 18-25) tonight, and sitting with them for the past 2 hours, a couple of things touched my heart. (Now mind you, I had to keep telling myself to let go of what I've learned through reading what various scripture scholars have had to say, to get to a more personal place.) First, from Matthew, how incredibly alone and vulnerable Mary must feel when the angel Gabriel comes to her and says: "Hail favored one! The Lord is with you." Mary is said to be "greatly troubled" and ponders "what sort of greeting this might be". "Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God", Gabriel assures her. Of course the dialogue goes on, describing the Immaculate Conception. But then it focuses on Elizabeth and the miraculous conceptiont that has occurred in her at HER age. Gabriel says "nothing will be impossible for God." Mary then replies "Behold, I am the hand maid of the Lord" "May it be done to me according to your word". What Mary says here touches me because of her willingness to surrender and trust what Gabriel has told her. This is HER BODY that she is offering up. HER BLOOD that will be shed as she gives birth. In so doing she will in a sense also be offering HER blood for the forgiveness of sins, because she is giving birth to Jesus, the savior.
Maybe I'll get into my feelings about St. Nick, whom I know was an actual person, and birthday celebrations in general at another time. Right now I hear the Holy Spirit whispering in my ear to rest, and so I shall.
Dec 23, 2023·edited Dec 23, 2023Liked by Donny Mac
Lol You tried so hard not to give your opinion.. I just posted a few days ago about this. Very similar.
When I was a kid, my parents were new Christians and my grandparents really loved the tradition of Santa. My parents refused. Lol! Their compromise was to keep everything else and to really emphasize the birth of Christ. My grandmother tried to sneak Santa in anyway. Lol
I tell this story because I think it's really hard not to give into the pressure of Christmas when you have kids and when you enjoyed traditional Christmas as a child.
Now my parents also refused Halloween.. And because I never did it as a child, I never felt any pressure about it until my youngest son was about 10 years old and I gave in to a memory of not being able to do it. (He probably would have gotten over it , but I was projecting my feelings on him. Lord forgive me smh lol). So he did it for 3 years and now he's too old and I'm done with that.
I have also previously done some research on Christmas. When it comes to the date, for me it doesn't matter what date it is. We will never know the exact date of the birth of Jesus. Here in Australia, we celebrated the Queen's birthday, (now the King's) on a different day to their actual birthday.
So, for me the date is not important, but what we are celebrating.
Birthdays in general, celebrate the person coming to this world to be in our lives. That we are giving thanks for being a part of their lives and visa versa. It's to spend time with loved ones who all care for each other and want to show their love and appreciation to that person. To acknowledge them.
In the world today, it is difficult to get everyone together in one spot to spend time together and to enjoy being together. Birthdays brings us together and we are then able to show our true appreciation, love and respect for the person being celebrated.
In an ideal world, we would be able to do this all the time. And while I do celebrate my siblings, friends etc., we can't all come together, as a collective, to honour them. I love birthdays and Christmas as our whole family comes together to celebrate and show how special a certain person is. I think it's very special and such a happy and fun time. For me, it is about coming together. Being together and showing love for one another.
It's the same for Christmas. It's to acknowledge that Jesus has come in order to help us all. To honour what he is born to do. That for me is going to mass and the Carols written about Jesus, Mary and Joseph. About the wise men, the shepherds and the angels. They bring a joy to my heart. I think about the birth and this innocent child that is born. About all children that are born and how precious each birth is. About how lucky we are. About being part of a family. About coming together as a family to spend time together. To have fun and to know how very lucky we are.
Yes, Christmas is commercial, but as with birthdays, we give gifts, so on Christmas we give gifts. I love giving gifts as it brings me so much joy.
So for me Christmas is being with family and having fun. I believe that having traditions are a way of remembering those in our past that have left this world. That traditions we have made have meaning. It brings back memories of when my parents were alive. I don't see any harm in celebrating Santa. I think Jesus, God, the Holy Spirit, would just be happy that we spend quality time together with family, with love and laughter. In my family we also do joke gifts which are cheap and a whole lot of fun.
So although the date of the birth of Jesus isn't know, I love celebrating at this time as we are about to go into a new year to start a fresh. Like a newborn baby, we have new beginning ahead of us. So by going to church on Christmas Eve, I recognise that Jesus was born and that with his birth, I am blessed and can celebrate this.
On Christmas day, I can be with family and celebrate how lucky we are and enjoy what we have been given.
Great questions on this walk. I grew up in the Southern Baptist church in southern US - my grandparents came from a tradition of not celebrating Christmas as a holiday but as a day to appreciate the gifts provided by God. They decorated with natural wreaths, mistletoe and other fresh greenery in a very limited way - never over the top. As I became an adult and was baptized into the Lutheran faith, our celebration of Christmas was a holy time. Songs that are sung correlated with the teaching of the scripture. When we would leave the service on Christmas Eve, myself, my husband and sons would have quiet time to just reflect on what the day meant and to be thankful for what we had and not focus on the commercialism.
St. Nicholas for my kids was celebrated on Dec. 6 as is the tradition in Germany and so many other countries from that area. They enjoyed this tradition more so than the gifts of Christmas because it was part of their heritage and was not something they combined with the Christmas teachings.
As a teacher of young children - I am always taken aback by the material focus that rules this holiday. I am thankful that my husband and I made sure our boys understood that Christmas was a celebration of thankfulness and not of abundance. They continue this as adults. Once again, so much to ponder and think about on this walk - thank you.
Thank you for sharing Donny! I really thought and prayed for several days and let all this sink in before leaving a comment. It doesn't state in the Bible exactly when Jesus was born. I agree with you on that. For me personally it's a matter of the heart; "celebrate" means to exalt, worship, and praise. I believe the "name" of Jesus to be and include His birth, life, death, resurrection, ascension. I do my best to celebrate, rejoice, exalt, worship, praise the entire life of Jesus every day of the year, not just on Christian holidays. And yes, some days I'm much better at doing that than others. I'm grateful to God that I have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ and He forgives me each time I fail with His grace. As far as Santa Claus, my family grew up with the norm of Santa Claus. As I've aged and with no children, I don't place emphasis on that. Should I receive a gift, I'm gratefully blessed. If I choose to give, then that is placed on my heart I believe by God to gift. But gifts are not important to me. Sharing the life and the gospel message of Jesus Christ is the most important. This area is beautiful, and I especially was taken by the rainbow. Rainbows are very special to me. Thanks again!
Thank you for this walk which gives lots of things to really think about. I don't believe that Jesus was born in December as that is the winter in the Northern Hemisphere and the shepherds would not be out in the fields during winter. I guess my family celebrate it at this time of the year because that is what we have been bought up with and I am not sure God really cares when we celebrate as long as we remember the true meaning of what we celebrate but I may be wrong about that. There are so many conflicting things said when it comes to the Christmas Tree, and the Magi (according to one definition they were members of a priestly caste of ancient Persia. and because they saw the star and new it was important they may have been astrologers) Isaiah 60;6 mentions the bringing of Frankincense and Gold and proclaiming good news of the praises of the Lord. To me the giving of gifts symbolises the fact that Jesus was given as a gift to the world for the forgiveness of sin. I am one that does not go overboard with decorating or gift giving. Probably haven't answered your questions with all this though.
Hmmm. I'm asking myself how exactly to respond because, like you, I don't want to try to justify my stance, but in a way I feel that's what you're asking me to do. Scripture doesn't say "don't celebrate the birth of Jesus", so how we choose to do that has to be what's right in our own hearts. To me the exact date is not important, or whether all the details happened as tradition has dictated. I could go into what the tree means to me, why I decorate, why I give and receive gifts, why I sing certain songs, but I know in my heart that I do what I do because I love recognizing that God became flesh and dwelt among us and Jesus' birth was the beginning of God intervening in humanity in a way that would provide a way to be in relationship with Him. No time of year points to Christ more than Christmas. Some don't get the true meaning, but they have at least heard about it. The story of Easter has also been messed up with human traditions. In our house, Santa was always a fictitious character, but Jesus was real. I know you may disagree, but I think God gives us some grace for not having every detail exactly right as long as the focus is on worshipping Him and honoring the fact that he sent Jesus to earth for our salvation. I hope you can worship Him in spirit and in truth and not focus on how others choose to do it. Thanks for the questions. I sure don't have all the answers but do what the Spirit tells you is right for you. Stunning place for a prayer walk! Hope you have some joyful time with family on the 25th no matter what you think about the date! 😊
This prayer walk has been your most confrontational yet! I grew up celebrating Christmas with Santa and Jesus. Although, Santa was just a small part of the celebration. As I raised our children, we put the focus on Jesus and talked about what we could give to God for Christmas- sometimes it was adding to our tithes, buying for a needy family, doing a service project for someone, or baking goodies for people. Now that my kids are grown, I wish I had put even more emphasis on God's gift for us- salvation through Jesus. You asked if we thought God wanted us to celebrate Jesus' birthday. I would say, yes. Well, as the Bible says, the angels rejoiced, the shepherds rejoiced. Even Mary rejoiced in her heart. I think God wants us to celebrate. I am not sure that He is happy with all the secular emphasis though.
There is a lot to think about in this topic, and it is one I have struggled with for many years. Thank you for sharing this space for seeking God's truth.
I filled a page with notes over the last two days as I examine my own practices, our family traditions and what I observe in my community.
I have a lot of reading to do in light of the questions you asked.
Holy Spirit, show us how we can live in this world and honor God.
Glory to God in the highest!
"Research the Bible, its not just a book."
Hi Donny ~ I get the points you were making... But I had a long conversation with God after listening to your Prayer Walk today. I'm pretty sure I heard him say, "Keep doing what you're doing in memory of me." It's just a Faith thing for me. I feel good about celebrating Jesus's birth on Christmas with my family. Hope you are also surrounded by Love on Monday -- and everyday. ~ Jan xoxo
I grew up no different than most Anglican or protestant children. The thing is I was like you always looking for what was truth in Jesus. About 2012 I was wanting to attend a church that really honored God. The way I wanted to worship did not fit the church I was attending. I was told to go to a Messianic congregation. That was great advice because I did and never regretted it. I learned to much about all of the Jewish feast days. I learned how those days lined up with what really happened from the birth of Christ to the Passover and even Day of Pentecost. I do know Constantine.was not good for the Jews and he denied them their beliefs. The gentile church turned idols into saints to give them faces. They twisted the story of Abraham and Isaac to Abraham and Ishmael. Once the lies were told it was hard to see what was true. Scripture tells me this, ”And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.“
John 1:14 NKJV
When Jesus a set date was not established but based on Sukkot chances are great because of the desire to dwell with us it was possible while everyone was dwelling in tents no one would have had any indoor rooms available. Herod had heard the prophecy regarding Jesus. The wise men were spies and were out to kill Jesus at His birth.
We stopped having a normal Christmas tree years ago and Santa is not on anything here. I must admit I like the cute stories but I count them as what I find to be good to rejoice in them. I do birthdays to show my love to those I cherish. I wanted you to know I cheer your stance and love how you search the truth. There is so much to discuss on this topic. Know that you don’t offend me whatsoever. My daughter is dating a Muslim and he told me he is related to Jesus. All I could do was laugh. I know my prayer time has a new challenge. I’ll just say to you happy Holyday my friend.
I forgot to mention that my way of celebrating Christmas is first to be part of the Christmas Eve Mass at St. Francis parish where my husband works. It's beautiful, and Fr. Dick always invites the children to gather around the alter with him at a certain point, and asks them questions about who Jesus is ,and other related questions. (Some of the answers are pretty funny, while others are more serious and well thought out.) Then on Christmas Day my husband John and I usually go to a family dinner at his sister's condo. That's it, I promise! 🕊✨️
Hi Donny,
After reading the passages about Jesus's birth (Luke 1: 26-38, and Matthew 1: 18-25) tonight, and sitting with them for the past 2 hours, a couple of things touched my heart. (Now mind you, I had to keep telling myself to let go of what I've learned through reading what various scripture scholars have had to say, to get to a more personal place.) First, from Matthew, how incredibly alone and vulnerable Mary must feel when the angel Gabriel comes to her and says: "Hail favored one! The Lord is with you." Mary is said to be "greatly troubled" and ponders "what sort of greeting this might be". "Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God", Gabriel assures her. Of course the dialogue goes on, describing the Immaculate Conception. But then it focuses on Elizabeth and the miraculous conceptiont that has occurred in her at HER age. Gabriel says "nothing will be impossible for God." Mary then replies "Behold, I am the hand maid of the Lord" "May it be done to me according to your word". What Mary says here touches me because of her willingness to surrender and trust what Gabriel has told her. This is HER BODY that she is offering up. HER BLOOD that will be shed as she gives birth. In so doing she will in a sense also be offering HER blood for the forgiveness of sins, because she is giving birth to Jesus, the savior.
Maybe I'll get into my feelings about St. Nick, whom I know was an actual person, and birthday celebrations in general at another time. Right now I hear the Holy Spirit whispering in my ear to rest, and so I shall.
Lol You tried so hard not to give your opinion.. I just posted a few days ago about this. Very similar.
When I was a kid, my parents were new Christians and my grandparents really loved the tradition of Santa. My parents refused. Lol! Their compromise was to keep everything else and to really emphasize the birth of Christ. My grandmother tried to sneak Santa in anyway. Lol
I tell this story because I think it's really hard not to give into the pressure of Christmas when you have kids and when you enjoyed traditional Christmas as a child.
Now my parents also refused Halloween.. And because I never did it as a child, I never felt any pressure about it until my youngest son was about 10 years old and I gave in to a memory of not being able to do it. (He probably would have gotten over it , but I was projecting my feelings on him. Lord forgive me smh lol). So he did it for 3 years and now he's too old and I'm done with that.
Anyway great post! Great questions!!
I forgot- how do I send money to your bus project?
I have also previously done some research on Christmas. When it comes to the date, for me it doesn't matter what date it is. We will never know the exact date of the birth of Jesus. Here in Australia, we celebrated the Queen's birthday, (now the King's) on a different day to their actual birthday.
So, for me the date is not important, but what we are celebrating.
Birthdays in general, celebrate the person coming to this world to be in our lives. That we are giving thanks for being a part of their lives and visa versa. It's to spend time with loved ones who all care for each other and want to show their love and appreciation to that person. To acknowledge them.
In the world today, it is difficult to get everyone together in one spot to spend time together and to enjoy being together. Birthdays brings us together and we are then able to show our true appreciation, love and respect for the person being celebrated.
In an ideal world, we would be able to do this all the time. And while I do celebrate my siblings, friends etc., we can't all come together, as a collective, to honour them. I love birthdays and Christmas as our whole family comes together to celebrate and show how special a certain person is. I think it's very special and such a happy and fun time. For me, it is about coming together. Being together and showing love for one another.
It's the same for Christmas. It's to acknowledge that Jesus has come in order to help us all. To honour what he is born to do. That for me is going to mass and the Carols written about Jesus, Mary and Joseph. About the wise men, the shepherds and the angels. They bring a joy to my heart. I think about the birth and this innocent child that is born. About all children that are born and how precious each birth is. About how lucky we are. About being part of a family. About coming together as a family to spend time together. To have fun and to know how very lucky we are.
Yes, Christmas is commercial, but as with birthdays, we give gifts, so on Christmas we give gifts. I love giving gifts as it brings me so much joy.
So for me Christmas is being with family and having fun. I believe that having traditions are a way of remembering those in our past that have left this world. That traditions we have made have meaning. It brings back memories of when my parents were alive. I don't see any harm in celebrating Santa. I think Jesus, God, the Holy Spirit, would just be happy that we spend quality time together with family, with love and laughter. In my family we also do joke gifts which are cheap and a whole lot of fun.
So although the date of the birth of Jesus isn't know, I love celebrating at this time as we are about to go into a new year to start a fresh. Like a newborn baby, we have new beginning ahead of us. So by going to church on Christmas Eve, I recognise that Jesus was born and that with his birth, I am blessed and can celebrate this.
On Christmas day, I can be with family and celebrate how lucky we are and enjoy what we have been given.
Great questions on this walk. I grew up in the Southern Baptist church in southern US - my grandparents came from a tradition of not celebrating Christmas as a holiday but as a day to appreciate the gifts provided by God. They decorated with natural wreaths, mistletoe and other fresh greenery in a very limited way - never over the top. As I became an adult and was baptized into the Lutheran faith, our celebration of Christmas was a holy time. Songs that are sung correlated with the teaching of the scripture. When we would leave the service on Christmas Eve, myself, my husband and sons would have quiet time to just reflect on what the day meant and to be thankful for what we had and not focus on the commercialism.
St. Nicholas for my kids was celebrated on Dec. 6 as is the tradition in Germany and so many other countries from that area. They enjoyed this tradition more so than the gifts of Christmas because it was part of their heritage and was not something they combined with the Christmas teachings.
As a teacher of young children - I am always taken aback by the material focus that rules this holiday. I am thankful that my husband and I made sure our boys understood that Christmas was a celebration of thankfulness and not of abundance. They continue this as adults. Once again, so much to ponder and think about on this walk - thank you.
Thank you for sharing Donny! I really thought and prayed for several days and let all this sink in before leaving a comment. It doesn't state in the Bible exactly when Jesus was born. I agree with you on that. For me personally it's a matter of the heart; "celebrate" means to exalt, worship, and praise. I believe the "name" of Jesus to be and include His birth, life, death, resurrection, ascension. I do my best to celebrate, rejoice, exalt, worship, praise the entire life of Jesus every day of the year, not just on Christian holidays. And yes, some days I'm much better at doing that than others. I'm grateful to God that I have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ and He forgives me each time I fail with His grace. As far as Santa Claus, my family grew up with the norm of Santa Claus. As I've aged and with no children, I don't place emphasis on that. Should I receive a gift, I'm gratefully blessed. If I choose to give, then that is placed on my heart I believe by God to gift. But gifts are not important to me. Sharing the life and the gospel message of Jesus Christ is the most important. This area is beautiful, and I especially was taken by the rainbow. Rainbows are very special to me. Thanks again!
By the way, Merry Christmas everyone!!
I agree, though, Christ's birthday was probably in the spring, when the shepherds would have had the sheep out in the fields.